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Looking for a birthplace of three brothers WALTON between 1793 and 1804

Discussion in 'Middlesex' started by JOSTURM, Mar 19, 2021.

  1. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member

    Hi, John married Ann May nee Suett in 1842. Ann was the widow of Joseph May, brother of John's first wife Mary Ann snd Thomas's wife, Eliza. John and Ann had two children - Mary Ann in 1842/3 who died and in 1844, Marian Sarah. It is Marian Sarah who is living with her half-sister Georgiana Constable on the 51C.
    We think Ann died in 1856 in Clapton Square. John's last address before Hackney Workhouse in 1859 was Amhurst terrace in Hackney. In March 1860, John was transferred as a Pauper Lunatic to Colney Hatch where he died on May 10th. His body was taken out and he was buried in Bow Cemetery. We think William died in Islington in 1856.
     
  2. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member


    Hi - John Walton the father's date of death is not known. Nothing about him is known except that he had died by 1838 and was a baker.
     
  3. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member

    I shall take another look at the Masterclasses, thanks
     
  4. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member

    Thank you everybody for your advice and contribution.
     
  5. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member

    where do i find the 'Masterclass' ?
     
  6. Helen7

    Helen7 LostCousins Superstar

    Try this link - or this one.
     
  7. peter

    peter Administrator Staff Member

    There are links to all of my Masterclasses from the Subscribers Only page. Apart from the Baptisms Masterclass you might want to glance through Finding birth certificates as it covers similar ground and has been updated more recently.
     
  8. JOSTURM

    JOSTURM LostCousins Member

    Thank you Peter
     
  9. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    While I would tend to agree with Peter than it can benefit us all, no matter how experienced, to remind ourselves of the basics every now and then, when ancestors remain elusive we need to move beyond the basics to more advanced techniques.

    I have a number of ancestors for whom no baptism has been found - and probably never will be - but for whom I have nevertheless been able to identify their parents and origins. Even if I had found a possible baptism I would likely still have needed to consult other records to confirm the connection.
     
  10. peter

    peter Administrator Staff Member

    The Masterclass acts as a checklist, providing structure and making sure that we haven't forgotten any of the things that you or I would regard as basics, but which others wouldn't necessarily think of. As I said earlier in the discussion:
    Advanced techniques like family reconstitution and DNA require a whole Masterclass (or a book) to themselves.

    But my experience is that when people ask for help, whether on the forum or by emailing me directly, they usually haven't done the basic analysis. That's why my first question is always to ask whether they've worked through the Masterclass, and the second is to ask what conclusions they came to.
     
  11. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    I'm not sure that I have generally considered family reconstruction to be an advanced technique, though perhaps it is, but of course it only works if your elusive ancestor was born relatively close to where he/she lived and worked.

    It's a technique which is always worth trying, and I generally do, but it's not one I have had that much success with.
     
  12. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    If you think Eliza Jane Walton and Emily Walton were sisters of your John, then (from this 1841 census entry) have you worked out how Maria Walton (wife of John Whiting) fits into the family?

    It looks to me, despite a smudge, as though the first witness at Maria's marriage was a John Walton, and since this was 1809 it seems unlikely to be the brother John. Could it be the father John?
     
  13. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    Although you haven't said yet if you think Maria Walton might be another sister in this family, I did have a quick look for further information on her. It seems her husband, John Whiting, may have died in 1850 (Islington district, aged 66), and since I didn't spot a remarriage for Maria, it's possible she was the Maria Whiting who died in 1866 in the Clerkenwell district, aged 85.

    I couldn't find this Maria Whiting in 1851 but I did find a possible 1861 census entry in Clerkenwell - RG9 197 Fo: 91 p: 46. The ages don't quite match up but the entry does include a birthplace.

    So there are a lot of ifs and maybes here but there is at least a birthplace which you may feel is worth following up on.
     
  14. peter

    peter Administrator Staff Member

    It's about time there was some feedback regarding the basic steps in the Masterclass. Unless I've missed it, nobody seems to have mentioned the possibility that the children didn't know where they were born, or that the name of the father shown on the marriage certificates is wrong (just because the same name appears on two marriage certificates doesn't make it right).
     
  15. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    That may be because, with this particular puzzle, since there was no specific birthplace to go on, it was perhaps somewhat academic.

    I did mention that birthplaces in the 1841 census were not always that reliable, so even if the brothers knew exactly where they were born, it still only narrowed down the birthplace to either in Middlesex or not in Middlesex - which doesn't exactly narrow things down a lot!

    But just to clarify things, if Maria should prove to be another sister, and if the information given above does relate to the right Maria, it doesn't mean that either she or her siblings were necessarily born in Richmond. But it might nevertheless provide a useful starting point.
     
  16. peter

    peter Administrator Staff Member

    That's not the impression I got from the early part of the discussion.
     
  17. At home in NZ

    At home in NZ LostCousins Star

    Found Maria Walton born in Richmond in 1782, baptised 16 Jun, father Benjamin, mother Ann.
     
  18. Pauline

    Pauline LostCousins Megastar

    I found this baptism, and initially thought it didn't really help much, but then I found that the father Benjamin, then of Islington, left a will proved 1839 PCC. In it he mentions his daughters Marya Whiting and Emela Walton, his "poor fatherless and motherless" great granddaughter Eliza Saunders, and his grandsons William and John Walton.

    So Benjamin appears to be father of the Maria and Emily Walton mentioned above, and grandfather of the Eliza Jane Walton who married George Saunders. So is he also grandfather of the 3 brothers?
     
  19. Helen7

    Helen7 LostCousins Superstar

    Great detective work, Pauline! If the 3 brothers were sons of Benjamin's son John who pre-deceased him, it would fit. It would be good to find John's and Emily's baptisms to support your hypothesis. The only other baptism to Benjamin and Ann in Richmond I can see is Elizabeth in 1781.
     
    • Thanks! Thanks! x 1
  20. At home in NZ

    At home in NZ LostCousins Star

    I agree with Helen about Pauline's work, well done. I would have attempted it but knew from past experience that Pauline would likely do so.
    It would now be nice to know what JOSTURM thinks.
     

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